Noise Marine kit possibilities

[LSM]

Awhile back I wrote out some thoughts on B&C about what could be in a new Noise Marine kit. To do this I looked at the other Cult Troops, as well as the basic Chaos Space Marine (Legionaries) kit, to get a sense of what was physically possibly.

Now, Noise Marines have always been pretty diverse, compared to the other Cult Troops. I'll stick my original thoughts below, but what formed up in my mind was two main possibilities that I'd be happy with, and both are... that I'd like to see Noise Marines broken up into two kits - one melee focussed, one ranged. Having just one kit feels like it would have to be so stuffed with... stuff... that there'd be no room for any options or new toys.

First combination:

• 10-man ranged unit, all Sonic Weapons, tons of options, bunch of new stuff
• 5-man melee dual kit, with the option of Chainswords + Doom Sirens or Accursed Weapons + Combat Drug Dispensers

Second combination:

• 10-man melee kit, tons of options, bunch of new stuff (and maybe some token Sonic Weapons)
• 6-man ranged "Kakophoni" kit, with all Sonic Weapons, tons of options, bunch of new stuff

Third possibility:

• 10-man mixed arms kit, with Sonic Weapons and Bolt Pistols + Chainswords, limited options, no new stuff

Fourth possibility:

• 6-man mixed arms kit, with Sonic Weapons and Bolt Pistols + Chainswords, tons of options, and a bunch of new stuff

//

Anyway, original post:

To begin, I decided to have a look at the current kits for the other three Cult Troops. (I'll note that all are three-sprue kits.)

RUBRIC MARINES
Bodies: 10 Legs + Tabbards, 11 Chest Plates, 10 Back Packs, 20 Shoulder Pads, 10 Heads
Weapons: 10 Bolters, 10 Warpflamers, 1 Soulreaper Cannon, ~2 Force Stave, 1 Bolt Pistol, 1 Warpflame Pistol
Accoutrements: 1 Icon, 2 Sorcerer Hands, 1 Cape, 1 Scroll, 2 Sorcerer Shoulder Pads, 2 Sorcerer Heads

Perhaps it's important to mention what this replaced. The previous generation of Rubric Marines was a metal/finecast upgrade kit for the basic CSM box (like the current Noise Marines) - it included an Aspiring Sorcerer with Bolt Pistol and Force Weapon, and enough Heads, Chest Plates, Shoulder Pads, and Bolters to make eight Thousand Sons (the CSM kit having good parts for an Tzeentch Icon bearer already). They were not discernably of a particular mark (unlike Jes Goodwin's originals, which were explicitly MkIV).

So right off the bat we see that they're a full ten-model unit, and back to all being MkIV. These are still the old, less mono-pose style, with less dynamic poses (admittedly fitting for their lack of autonomy). The Sorcerer has gained some build options, but the biggest thing here is the entire new weapon options: Warpflamers (and pistol), and the Soulreaper Cannon. These greatly expanded what Rubric Marines had been (since 3rd). Also notable to me: none of the Shoulder Pads have sculpted Thousand Sons symbols, despite Rubric Marines being the Cult Troop most associated with a legion. (Indeed, the unit was straight up called 'Thousand Sons' instead of Rubric Marines.)

PLAGUE MARINES
Bodies: 7 Legs, 13 Chest Plates, ~8 Pack Packs, ~19 Shoulder Pads (5 DG), 18 Heads
Weapons: 8 Bolters, ~4 Bubotic Weapons, 3 Heavy Plague Weapon, 1 Plasma Gun, 1 Meltagun, 1 Plague Belcher, 1 Plague Spewer, 1 Blight Launcher, 1 Bolt Pistol, 1 Plasma Pistol
Accoutrements: 1 Icon, 2 Blight Grenades, 2 Hands, 1 Cape, 1 Arm Cape, 1 Chainmail Capette

The previous generation of Plague Marines came in a seven-model metal/finecast unit, one Plasma Gun and six Bolters, four with Plague Knife in hand. Rules wise, the Champion had standard options for the time, and the squad could take a couple Plasma Pistols/Plasma Guns/Meltaguns/Flamers. The models were designed along the lines of the CSM kit, as opposed to Jes Goodwin's original MkIII designs.

The new kit keeps the same number of models (seven), which I know aggravates a number of people. They returned to being clearly MkIII, and while they are sculpted in the modern, more mono-pose style, the great number of diverse options in the kit (Chests, Heads, Shoulder Pads) stops individuals from feeling "samey" across multiple units. (This is also great for me, who loves half of the Nurgle aesthetic and loathes the other half). Their more "solid" poses also lets you build them "off-instruction" with only a bit of fuss. I put a tilde in front of some of the options as they're connected to another part (ie. there are eight Back Packs, but one is specifically for the Plague Spewer, and some of the Shoulder Pad options are built-in to specific arms). Of the various Shoulder Pads, only 5 are specifically for the Death Guard.

The kit provides more than enough Bolters, a full assortment of special weapons, and introduced a number of new heavy and close combat weapon options. Probably too many, honestly, and 10th edition amalgamating these down to "Bubotic Weapons" and "Heavy Plague Weapons" was probably a good thing.

[At this point, I've been told the post is too big, so it will be continued in the first reply.]

 

[LSM]

KHORNE BERZERKERS
Bodies: 10 Legs, 10 Chest Plates, ~10 Back Packs, 24 Shoulder Pads (10 WE, 8 'Cat), 26 Heads (15 Unhelmeted)
Weapons: 11 Chainblades, 2 Eviscerators, 10 Bolt Pistols (5 Bare Arm), 3 Plasma Pistols
Accoutrements: 1 Icon, ~8 Holsters/Chains

The... classic... Berzerkers sprue had four models on it - four Legs, Chests, pairs of Shoulder Pads, Bolt Pistols, Helmeted Heads, and Chainblades, some sheathed weapons, grenades, and holsters, plus an Unhelmeted Head and a Plasma Pistol. These were sold three to a box (for a total of twelve models). They fit with the regular CSM (aesthetically, being MkV). Rules wise, the Champion had standard options for the time, and two 'Zerks could take Plasma Pistols.

The updated kit kept the Plasma Pistols, the classic mix of Chain Swords and Axes, and added two Eviscerators. Champions lost rules options, but those technically weren't present in the previous kit itself. (Still, sad that there's no Power Fist present.) I'm... not a huge fan of the lack of options here - the ten bodies are all monopose, with no real room for variance (the Holsters and Chains are designed for specific bodies, and I debated whether to even include them as extras). There are also just the 24 shoulder pads for ten models, 10 of which are World Eater specific, and a lot of the weapons seem fitted for specific individuals do to the poses (though I haven't built the kit). The main source of variation seems to be the heads - of which there are a lot.

//

Alright, so let's look at where Noise Marines are right now. Kit wise... two horrible finecast packs, one with five Sonic Blaster and a Blastmaster, the other with one Sonic Blaster, one Blastmaster, a torso (that doesn't fit anything), a Back Pack, a Power Sword, and three Heads. Rules wise, the squad is one Blastmaster, Bolters/Sonic Blasters/BP&CS on all models, one Icon Bearer, and a Champion who can have a Doom Siren and the standard assortment of options.

To start: I think they'll loose the Bolters. It's tricky, because Noise Marines have gone so long with three basic options, but I don't think they'll all fit and if you have to lose one: it's the Bolters. (Plus, they didn't have them pre-3.5 anyway.)

Even then, if a baseline exists that every Noise Marine in the kit must be able to be equipped with either BP&CS or Sonic Blaster, I feel like a three-sprue, ten-model kit quickly runs out of room. The Rubric Marines pull off two weapons but they use the same arms. The Berzerkers are nowhere near, and the Plague Marines... well, they all have multiple builds but only have seven models in a kit. Instead, it might also be handy to look at what comes in the current Chaos Space Marine box (also three sprues, not including the Kill Team upgrades):

CSM LEGIONARIES
Bodies: 10 Legs, 12 Chest Plates, 10 Back Packs, ~24 Shoulder Pads, 14 Heads
Weapons: 8 Bolters, 7 Chainswords, 7 Bolt Pistols, 1 Meltagun, 1 Plasma Gun, 1 Flamer, 1 Missile Launcher, 1 Heavy Bolter, 1 Power Fist, 2 Accursed Weapons, 2 Plasma Pistols
Accoutrements: 2 Icons, 7 Back Pack Adornments

When taking into account that Noise Marines tend to be depicted in art with "bigger" Back Packs - mounted with speaker arrays, or drug dispensers - and that Sonic Blasters are traditionally bigger than Bolters, we lose some more space. On the other hand, unlike the Plague Marines' chunky MkIII, the (expected) MkVI shouldn't need more room. So I think you could reasonably see a kit that looked like:

NOISE MARINES
Bodies: 10 Legs, 12 Chest Plates, 10 Back Packs, 22 Shoulder Pads (10 EC), 14 Heads
Weapons: 9 Sonic Blasters, 9 Chainswords, 9 Bolt Pistols, 1 Doom Siren, 1 Blastmaster, 1 [New Melee Weapon], 1 Power Fist, 1 Accursed Weapons
Accoutrements: 1 Icon

And I'd be reasonably happy about that, but... building up to a potentially controversial opinion: I found the Berzerkers reveal to be kind of boring. Possibly down to the fact that they're quite similar to the Legionaries (MkV) in general, but I think it was looking over the kit and realising that... there are no real interesting choices to be made in how you put them together. No new weird additions. When it comes to Noise Marines, I want them to be a riot. I want every model to have the option of being adorned with corrupted Aquilas or grafted speakers, bejewelled bondage gear or stitched flesh... or some bizarre ornament of the Dark Prince. I want a variety of giant wild crests to add to their helmets, trophies, sequined capes, pteruges, and other dangling nonsense. And I want new sonic weapons. An energy throwing guitar (Power Axe?). Percussive mauls to drum an opponent into paste. Combat drugs and Needle Guns.

The question is how to get it. My preferred answer would be to split Noise Marines - one keeping the name and the sonic stylings, and the other getting the melee builds and Combat Drugs. But if they do stay united... I'm open to a six-model kit.

I'd also ask GW to take cross-model options into account. Six out of ten of the CSM Legionaries come with a chest piece that is just the breast plate (no abdomen or groin). It's not hard to make any of these six go on any of the six legs, requiring only a tiny bit of cutting/gap filling. But... why couldn't they just have been designed with a universal fit?

 

[Firebrand]

a torso (that doesn't fit anything)

I smashed it onto a Legionaries kit set of legs, looks fine but was finicky to do.

I'd also ask GW to take cross-model options into account. Six out of ten of the CSM Legionaries come with a chest piece that is just the breast plate (no abdomen or groin). It's not hard to make any of these six go on any of the six legs, requiring only a tiny bit of cutting/gap filling. But... why couldn't they just have been designed with a universal fit?

One of modern GW's biggest crimes, in my opinion. They want you buying a new kit each time you need a new squad, not getting max value out of each box. It's still possible, as you say, but truly versatile kits seem to be more and more a thing of the past.

Also trying to make recasting harder by the bizarre way they put sprues together, which has seemingly posed zero issues for any caster.

 

[Sea Dragon]

I smashed it onto a Legionaries kit set of legs, looks fine but was finicky to do.


One of modern GW's biggest crimes, in my opinion. They want you buying a new kit each time you need a new squad, not getting max value out of each box. It's still possible, as you say, but truly versatile kits seem to be more and more a thing of the past.

Also trying to make recasting harder by the bizarre way they put sprues together, which has seemingly posed zero issues for any caster.

I really dislike the new kits being so rigid. Sweet were the days of the fully multi-part kits, when kitbashing was a breeze. Give me seperate torso, legs and arms, please!

 

[Arkzein]

This is pretty great analysis of the various kits. I'd definitely agree that bolters will be gone. I was thinking something along the lines off:

Bodies:
10 Legs,
12 Chest Plates (2EC/Champ),
10 Back Packs (maybe 12 if doom siren options, champ has it and +2 or 3 for marines),
20 Shoulder Pads (10 EC), 1
5 (18 if Doom siren) Heads

Weapons:
9 Sonic Blasters,
9 Chainswords(I was thinkign justy plain swords, but hard to see it),
9 Bolt Pistols,
3-4 Doom Siren,
1 Blastmaster,
1 Unique Heavy Melle
1 Power Fist,
1 Accursed Weapons
1 Plasma Pistol
1 Icon

Basically the same, just that I have a sneaking suspicions that Doom sirens will have the option to replace special weapons, plus the champ, so will see 3 of them. Outside chance we can end up with a melee unit with 4 of them too, but much more unlikely.

If the doom siren is a backback 'upgrade' (Like some of the attachments you can have on the back of Legionary backpacks, then I could see that as well and would be space saving. Likewise if they go for head options with speaker mouths (like the 2nd Ed champion) as the doom siren look.,

 

[Sea Dragon]

This is pretty great analysis of the various kits. I'd definitely agree that bolters will be gone. I was thinking something along the lines off:

Bodies:
10 Legs,
12 Chest Plates (2EC/Champ),
10 Back Packs (maybe 12 if doom siren options, champ has it and +2 or 3 for marines),
20 Shoulder Pads (10 EC), 1
5 (18 if Doom siren) Heads

Weapons:
9 Sonic Blasters,
9 Chainswords(I was thinkign justy plain swords, but hard to see it),
9 Bolt Pistols,
3-4 Doom Siren,
1 Blastmaster,
1 Unique Heavy Melle
1 Power Fist,
1 Accursed Weapons
1 Plasma Pistol
1 Icon

Basically the same, just that I have a sneaking suspicions that Doom sirens will have the option to replace special weapons, plus the champ, so will see 3 of them. Outside chance we can end up with a melee unit with 4 of them too, but much more unlikely.

If the doom siren is a backback 'upgrade' (Like some of the attachments you can have on the back of Legionary backpacks, then I could see that as well and would be space saving. Likewise if they go for head options with speaker mouths (like the 2nd Ed champion) as the doom siren look.,

I just wonder what aesthetic they will go with. Old rock and roll? Baroque decadent? Hellraiser body horror? In a perfect world, it would be all three and even more, to mix and match showing the true variety, individualism and eccentric nature of our beloved noise marines. If I had to choose only one, to the exclusion of the others, I'd go with baroque: plenty of filigrane, greek masks and faces everywhere, musical grilles... A personal choice, ofc.

 

[Firebrand]

You think they'd go softly on the baroque look, to separate from the Heresy stuff a bit. Maybe the old school hair metal might be a bit dated.

Personally, I love all three takes, and would like them mixed in. EC should be a carnival of OTT fuckery.

 

[LSM]

I'd also prefer a mix of all three looks (metal, baroque, cenobite), and think that all three work pretty well in concert.

The mix is probably my favourite thing about certain Noise Marine art pieces; and I think the whole would be lesser for the absence of any single motif.

 

[Firebrand]

Agreed wholeheartedly.

 

[Arkzein]

Hedonites mostly went down the refined (silks, gold) look with a little bit of the old lust route. They have the fat guy on a chariot as well. The thricefold discord with the "fat' Daemonette shows some in the GW team get that gluttony is a form of excess too, plus in the recent novel (forget the name) there was a 'fat' mutated marine and essentially 40k Sigvald (appearance wise) so could see both.

Same as all of you though, would love variety with the quality of the Death Guard releases. I think the fact we can and should have such variety means if they lean into one it'll just not feel right. The rock side is the least appearing to me, absolutely love them but they no longer fit Grim Dark. Lust, Cenbite and Gluttony are the easiest themes of excess and pain / please to model.

If we end up with all rockers, all sensual, all cenobite / drug fueled or (unlikely) all fat then no one is happy.

 

[Firebrand]

Yup, focusing on a single aspect of the legion would be the worst result possible.

 

[LSM]

Mmhhmm...

The Death Guard are a good example - I have a small force (originally just a Kill Team, but it's been growing annoyingly). And... I have this huge love/hate relationship with their aesthetic, but a lot of the kits have so many options that I'm able to just use the bits that I love and ignore the bits that I hate. (Or, thanks to it being Chaos, it's really easy to just cut away something and then stick bits of guitar wire or hobby chain out of the resulting hole.)

On the other hand... things like Deathshroud (where my love/hate is 85/15, percent wise) means I'm all over them, while Blightlords (40/60) I'd probably never pick up (and just kitbash, if I ever wanted to field them). So a range of aesthetics in the unit is important, but that can also be helped by having a wider range of units.

 

[Sea Dragon]

Hedonites mostly went down the refined (silks, gold) look with a little bit of the old lust route. They have the fat guy on a chariot as well. The thricefold discord with the "fat' Daemonette shows some in the GW team get that gluttony is a form of excess too, plus in the recent novel (forget the name) there was a 'fat' mutated marine and essentially 40k Sigvald (appearance wise) so could see both.

Same as all of you though, would love variety with the quality of the Death Guard releases. I think the fact we can and should have such variety means if they lean into one it'll just not feel right. The rock side is the least appearing to me, absolutely love them but they no longer fit Grim Dark. Lust, Cenbite and Gluttony are the easiest themes of excess and pain / please to model.

If we end up with all rockers, all sensual, all cenobite / drug fueled or (unlikely) all fat then no one is happy.

I guess that gluttony is way more marketable than lust, although an entire legion of fat marines wouldn't be very appealing or marketable as a perfectionist army of psychos either, so I guess it will indeed have to be a mix, if they want to include that aspect. Even though DG is already fat af.

 

[Firebrand]

Mmhhmm...

The Death Guard are a good example - I have a small force (originally just a Kill Team, but it's been growing annoyingly). And... I have this huge love/hate relationship with their aesthetic, but a lot of the kits have so many options that I'm able to just use the bits that I love and ignore the bits that I hate. (Or, thanks to it being Chaos, it's really easy to just cut away something and then stick bits of guitar wire or hobby chain out of the resulting hole.)

On the other hand... things like Deathshroud (where my love/hate is 85/15, percent wise) means I'm all over them, while Blightlords (40/60) I'd probably never pick up (and just kitbash, if I ever wanted to field them). So a range of aesthetics in the unit is important, but that can also be helped by having a wider range of units.

The Death Guard in the Conquest partworks are what drew me back into minipainting. From what I've read, the reason their release was so, so much better than the TS and WE was because the guy heading it up was an actual DG fanatic(and IIRC, had done most of the conversions and kitbashes in pervious edition books). Seems like something they should do with all releases to an extent. At least when designing the aesthetic, get guys on board who are already deep into that faction. People who already know the vibe and what fellow fans like about them.

 

[Sea Dragon]

The Death Guard in the Conquest partworks are what drew me back into minipainting. From what I've read, the reason their release was so, so much better than the TS and WE was because the guy heading it up was an actual DG fanatic(and IIRC, had done most of the conversions and kitbashes in pervious edition books). Seems like something they should do with all releases to an extent. At least when designing the aesthetic, get guys on board who are already deep into that faction. People who already know the vibe and what fellow fans like about them.

Would make sense, but I wonder if someone at GW actually likes EC, specially considering how abandoned we have been for decades. And even if there was someone, they could end up enforcing their view of the faction with negative effects, like with Matt Ward smurfs or with the horrible Gav Thorpe Eldar novels

 

[Firebrand]

Would make sense, but I wonder if someone at GW actually likes EC, specially considering how abandoned we have been for decades. And even if there was someone, they could end up enforcing their view of the faction with negative effects, like with Matt Ward smurfs or with the horrible Gav Thorpe Eldar novels

Oh yeah! I'm purely considering from the minis themselves, rather than the lore and rules.

I did suggest at one point, since there'll likely be a loyal Primarch released nearby, that the lore should be that Fulgrim returns to bet DOOMRIDER that he can't do a wheelie across the entire Cicatrix Maledictum, and the Khan returns to prevent him becoming the raddest biker in the galaxy.

 

[Sea Dragon]

Oh yeah! I'm purely considering from the minis themselves, rather than the lore and rules.

I did suggest at one point, since there'll likely be a loyal Primarch released nearby, that the lore should be that Fulgrim returns to bet DOOMRIDER that he can't do a wheelie across the entire Cicatrix Maledictum, and the Khan returns to prevent him becoming the raddest biker in the galaxy.

Ok, now you gave me an idea, just imagine a specialist game like Gorkamorka, but with bike races between Doomrider, Khan and that Ork boss who is crossing the galaxy on his bike using portals!

 

[Firebrand]

Yessssssss!